I watched a presentation by Mike Williams complete with all the back to back images of real Paul faux Paul. I’m totally willing to be moved by the evidence but the evidence presented did not add up. In all honestly, I felt like I was being asked to simply trust the presentation, in the same way we are being told to trust the presentation of the contagion of viruses.
What I do know is true is that the music out out under the name The Beatles is lusciously good only now I listen to it with a twinge of curiosity how the hell Tavistock had any handle on making such a catalogue of b.a. songs!
I was led by the evidence, and that precluded writing 14-16 songs in a similar number of available days. Singing the vocal parts could just be done in that time.
But conceiving, writing, amending, writing parts, rehearsing and recording so many top class songs from a blank sheet? Those who’ve worked in the business say not possible.
I don’t get a bonus if you choose to believe this. I really don’t care one way or another. What I’ve learned is they’re all involved to varying degrees of knowledge in engineering society. Alan Watt (RIP), a respected Scottish thinker and commentator, describes this in a number of his long monologues.
Mark Devlin kills any doubt one may have stone dead. He was a commercial DJ during the 1990s & noughties before waking up. He’s researched the backgrounds of numerous bands and artists. Almost all are linked to military intelligence or psychological research via families and associates. Once seen, it’s intolerable to listen to the worst of them, like Geldoff, Sting, Bono, Bowie etc etc.
They push agendas that mesh perfectly with what’s happening right now. Only a few definitively knew / know what their work was about. I know McCartney does. I doubt Ozzy Osborne does.
It’s up to you. I can’t consume “culture” any more. It’s all contaminated in the same way. Actually, allow me to qualify. All of those who’ve become household names are culpable. Genuine grassroots music is just terrific.
I am very familiar with Bowie's career and as an English major as well as music student you can be sure I read carefully. What agendas do you mean specifically?
Two ideas here, Mike. The first is your whole argument that culture was manipulated by CONTENT falls short of the fact that culture and consciousness are shaped and transformed by the CONDUCTING MEDIUM.
The die was cast on the 1960s well before there were TVs in every home. Television transformed society into what we think of as the Sixties (the chaos, the need for action and involvement, the personal transformations, the art), with nothing to do with the content. These arguments never demonstrate any line of reasoning from content to result: that song did that thing. That genre did that thing.
Apropos of the 1960s, I don't expect you to consider an astrological scenario, but the astrology tells the story better than any record album or band or institute.
In terms of the production speed, here is the testimony of Rob Fraboni, interviewed on this topic for this purpose. He gives the example of the Planet Waves album mostly written (eight or nine of its 11 songs) and entirely recorded in four days: three main collaborators, Dylan, Robbie Robertson and Fraboni. He was the engineer/producer. He watched and assisted Dylan going from words written in Flair pen written on yellow pad to finished recording of one song in three hours. He got the song in one take. Memorized -- not referring to notes or music.
I think you can see what I am getting at here — the "Tavistock Critique" is all based on the idea that the content of the songs influenced society, correct? That the lyrics "revealed agendas" that later came true. Would you agree with that as the angle of analysis?
A famous example is the Red Hot Chilli Peppers “Californication”.
I understood the social engineering drive was very much pushing certain narratives through song craft, lyrics, chord progressions, melodies as well as lifestyle based on what their fans saw or believed them to do or be like.
“Sex & drugs & rock’n’roll gives us two thumbs up.
Most bands or artists has a subset of themes to push into their unsuspecting young fans.
Bowie’s early androgyny, cross dressing, alleged bisexuality, simulated oral sec on stage; his long term sense of alienation; his notoriously extreme use of cocaine.
Much more recently, Oasis pushed bad manners, heavy drug use, hopelessness (despite the upbeat music).
This is my position exactly. Mike, following your lead from a month or two ago, I looked into this and into Tavistock. I have investigated many, many types of fraud, and this not revealing itself to be so.
From the standpoint not of music history but of being MOVED by the music, I have full faith in my heart's response to the work itself. I am HIGHLY sensitive to media products and how they make me feel.
The probable cause here seems to be that Rubber Soul was done in six weeks. I am close friends (for 15 years) with Rob Fraboni, who has produced Dylan, The Band, The Rolling Stones, Eric Clapton etc., and we addressed the topic of a record done in six weeks in 1965 including without all the material written. You can hear his testimony here. Rob is a real person who has made me dinner in his home.
We are friends in part because he produced the Planet Waves album by Dylan and the Band, which was done in four days total, with only two of the 11 songs written on day one. For the Beatles, this was their sixth record, they had planed a thousand shows by that time (mostly in Hamburg), and they had the help of George Martin and the Abbey Road pops — and a LOT of energy moving them.
Fellow Wings fan here, Eric - even Mull of Kintyre, which elicits groans from many!
I have just danced around my kitchen to Coming Up, my favourite Paul McCartney solo song. It's guaranteed to boost your mood and the video with McCartney playing all the instruments is a good laugh (even Linda looks like she's enjoying herself).
Ram is another good album.
Faul or Paul - if the music makes you feel good that's good enough for me.
Sad to hear. We're getting to the time when many of our legendary musicians are going to pass over. I'll be most gutted when Donald Fagen goes. The saddest thing is that there isn't anyone coming up behind them who holds a candle to them in my (admittedly middle aged) view!
Tastes change, each generation is different. The Beatles were the original boyband fit for their time. The music industry decides who we get to hear and which musicians gets to be successful. I suspect the Beatles would do fine now, they'd just be marketed differently.
Yes, there has to be an appreciative audience, but do you think a band which forms and starts out organically has much chance of success these days without being shaped and compromised by the industry star makers?
In astrology aren't there markers of cultural change which help define each generations style and response to music?
Yes, well known, establishment endorsed figure here. I played his music to my children (cringe), but the songs were good fun and entertaining, unless you're reading into the lyrics ("Jake the Peg with his extra leg.."). It's a minefield out there.
Harris painted the Queen's portrait. However, nearly all child sex abuse goes on in the home, by people known to the parents, including the parents themselves, relatives, carers, etc. The outrageous public stories are a scrim for what happens right in front of us. I have heard some version of this from a client more times than I can count
YOUR PEOPLE CAN READ MINDS? DID YOU GET UP ON THE WRONG SIDE OF YER TORTURE RACK THIS A.M. OR IS THIS AN a a-i troll responding as YOU? FUNNY YOU DID NOT SAY ONLY YER HAIRDRESSER WOULD KNOW
WELL IT JUST SO HAPPENS I LOST MY ARMS AND EYESIGHT AND IT IS HARD FOR ME TO DO MANY THINGS YA KNOW I BATTLE TROLLS DAILY WHOM ARE ON DRUGS AND ALCOHOL WHO SEEM TO THINK CAPITAL LETTERS ARE YELLING AT THEM SO I LET THEM KNOW I WILL PRAY FOR THEM WHETHER THEY LIKE IT OR NOT AND YES YOUNG MAN I AM A VETERAN. I HAD EXPLAINED ALL WHEN I FIRST SUBSCRIBED TO SUBSTACK
Such a great album! Listening to it again reminds me of my father (now 92 years old), who at the time couldn't wait to hear what McCartney would do after the Beatles. He was so excited and played it over and over again. I was 12 and a big Beatles lover myself :-) This record grew on me as I moved into teenager-hood. Thanks!
Unfortunately, the myth of the Beatles isn’t true.
https://sageofquaynews.blogspot.com/2023/05/did-beatles-write-all-their-own-music.html
No one is more crushed by learning of social engineering and the role of The Tavistock Institute than I am.
Mike Williams (Sage of Quay) is a leading Beatles researcher.
In U.K., Mark Devlin is the leading researcher on the use of music to shape societies over the last 60+ years.
https://djmarkdevlin.com/
I watched a presentation by Mike Williams complete with all the back to back images of real Paul faux Paul. I’m totally willing to be moved by the evidence but the evidence presented did not add up. In all honestly, I felt like I was being asked to simply trust the presentation, in the same way we are being told to trust the presentation of the contagion of viruses.
What I do know is true is that the music out out under the name The Beatles is lusciously good only now I listen to it with a twinge of curiosity how the hell Tavistock had any handle on making such a catalogue of b.a. songs!
I was led by the evidence, and that precluded writing 14-16 songs in a similar number of available days. Singing the vocal parts could just be done in that time.
But conceiving, writing, amending, writing parts, rehearsing and recording so many top class songs from a blank sheet? Those who’ve worked in the business say not possible.
I don’t get a bonus if you choose to believe this. I really don’t care one way or another. What I’ve learned is they’re all involved to varying degrees of knowledge in engineering society. Alan Watt (RIP), a respected Scottish thinker and commentator, describes this in a number of his long monologues.
Mark Devlin kills any doubt one may have stone dead. He was a commercial DJ during the 1990s & noughties before waking up. He’s researched the backgrounds of numerous bands and artists. Almost all are linked to military intelligence or psychological research via families and associates. Once seen, it’s intolerable to listen to the worst of them, like Geldoff, Sting, Bono, Bowie etc etc.
They push agendas that mesh perfectly with what’s happening right now. Only a few definitively knew / know what their work was about. I know McCartney does. I doubt Ozzy Osborne does.
It’s up to you. I can’t consume “culture” any more. It’s all contaminated in the same way. Actually, allow me to qualify. All of those who’ve become household names are culpable. Genuine grassroots music is just terrific.
On the matter of content, what is your beef with David Bowie?
It’s the realisation that his interesting career fulfilled his pushing certain agendas. I think they’re now obvious.
Worse, the insulting (to his fans) way his lifetime actor character was retired.
Compared to being chased by murderous lunatics with dangerous jabs, it’s no biggie.
Best to listen to Mark Devlin’s book series “Musical Truths”.
I am very familiar with Bowie's career and as an English major as well as music student you can be sure I read carefully. What agendas do you mean specifically?
edited
Two ideas here, Mike. The first is your whole argument that culture was manipulated by CONTENT falls short of the fact that culture and consciousness are shaped and transformed by the CONDUCTING MEDIUM.
The die was cast on the 1960s well before there were TVs in every home. Television transformed society into what we think of as the Sixties (the chaos, the need for action and involvement, the personal transformations, the art), with nothing to do with the content. These arguments never demonstrate any line of reasoning from content to result: that song did that thing. That genre did that thing.
Apropos of the 1960s, I don't expect you to consider an astrological scenario, but the astrology tells the story better than any record album or band or institute.
In terms of the production speed, here is the testimony of Rob Fraboni, interviewed on this topic for this purpose. He gives the example of the Planet Waves album mostly written (eight or nine of its 11 songs) and entirely recorded in four days: three main collaborators, Dylan, Robbie Robertson and Fraboni. He was the engineer/producer. He watched and assisted Dylan going from words written in Flair pen written on yellow pad to finished recording of one song in three hours. He got the song in one take. Memorized -- not referring to notes or music.
https://planetwaves.fm/side-by-side-record-producer-rob-fraboni-talks-about-the-beatles-recordings-with-and-without-his-reelfeel-technology/
I’m sure you’re right.
I’ve realised I know almost nothing.
I’m ok with it.
I think you can see what I am getting at here — the "Tavistock Critique" is all based on the idea that the content of the songs influenced society, correct? That the lyrics "revealed agendas" that later came true. Would you agree with that as the angle of analysis?
I think there’s some of that.
A famous example is the Red Hot Chilli Peppers “Californication”.
I understood the social engineering drive was very much pushing certain narratives through song craft, lyrics, chord progressions, melodies as well as lifestyle based on what their fans saw or believed them to do or be like.
“Sex & drugs & rock’n’roll gives us two thumbs up.
Most bands or artists has a subset of themes to push into their unsuspecting young fans.
Bowie’s early androgyny, cross dressing, alleged bisexuality, simulated oral sec on stage; his long term sense of alienation; his notoriously extreme use of cocaine.
Much more recently, Oasis pushed bad manners, heavy drug use, hopelessness (despite the upbeat music).
I’m no expert. Just an absolute beginner.
This is my position exactly. Mike, following your lead from a month or two ago, I looked into this and into Tavistock. I have investigated many, many types of fraud, and this not revealing itself to be so.
From the standpoint not of music history but of being MOVED by the music, I have full faith in my heart's response to the work itself. I am HIGHLY sensitive to media products and how they make me feel.
The probable cause here seems to be that Rubber Soul was done in six weeks. I am close friends (for 15 years) with Rob Fraboni, who has produced Dylan, The Band, The Rolling Stones, Eric Clapton etc., and we addressed the topic of a record done in six weeks in 1965 including without all the material written. You can hear his testimony here. Rob is a real person who has made me dinner in his home.
We are friends in part because he produced the Planet Waves album by Dylan and the Band, which was done in four days total, with only two of the 11 songs written on day one. For the Beatles, this was their sixth record, they had planed a thousand shows by that time (mostly in Hamburg), and they had the help of George Martin and the Abbey Road pops — and a LOT of energy moving them.
The discussion is here on its own player.
https://planetwaves.fm/extreme-electric-fantasy-edition-flat-earth-with-amandha-vollmer-rob-fraboni-on-the-beatles-and-tantra-studio-on-ideas-about-sex-for-young-men/
Thanks, Eric, that was such a nice musical romp!
Shame about Clement Freud on the cover. :(
Fellow Wings fan here, Eric - even Mull of Kintyre, which elicits groans from many!
I have just danced around my kitchen to Coming Up, my favourite Paul McCartney solo song. It's guaranteed to boost your mood and the video with McCartney playing all the instruments is a good laugh (even Linda looks like she's enjoying herself).
Ram is another good album.
Faul or Paul - if the music makes you feel good that's good enough for me.
Mull of Kintyre -- I consider one of the great Wings songs, co-written by Denny. (RIP - died last night)
Sad to hear. We're getting to the time when many of our legendary musicians are going to pass over. I'll be most gutted when Donald Fagen goes. The saddest thing is that there isn't anyone coming up behind them who holds a candle to them in my (admittedly middle aged) view!
The new musicians are not the problem — the new audience is. Today, I reckon the Beatles would flop.
Tastes change, each generation is different. The Beatles were the original boyband fit for their time. The music industry decides who we get to hear and which musicians gets to be successful. I suspect the Beatles would do fine now, they'd just be marketed differently.
are you familiar with the idea that the power comes from the ground, not the figure? That would be the audience, not the band, not the promoters.
Yes, there has to be an appreciative audience, but do you think a band which forms and starts out organically has much chance of success these days without being shaped and compromised by the industry star makers?
In astrology aren't there markers of cultural change which help define each generations style and response to music?
similar situation with https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rolf_Harris
Yes, well known, establishment endorsed figure here. I played his music to my children (cringe), but the songs were good fun and entertaining, unless you're reading into the lyrics ("Jake the Peg with his extra leg.."). It's a minefield out there.
Harris painted the Queen's portrait. However, nearly all child sex abuse goes on in the home, by people known to the parents, including the parents themselves, relatives, carers, etc. The outrageous public stories are a scrim for what happens right in front of us. I have heard some version of this from a client more times than I can count
https://www.amazon.com/Tiger-Memoir-Margaux-Fragoso/dp/0374277621
I BURIED PAUL
I'm sure you did, in your mind. Are you sure you're human?
Here's the thing about art. The imitation does not bring tears to your eyes. Only the real thing does.
And by the way, in the case of proving an imposter, you never know till you have them both in the same room at the same time.
MERRY CHRISTMAS “Rejoice with me, for I have found my sheep, which was lost.”
— Luke 15:6 🙏
MY STATEMENT WAS A JOKE ABOUT HIDDEN WORDS AND WHATS IN MY MIND STAYS THEIR ONLY GOD KNOWS MY UNSURE FRIEND
Ringo knows. Denny would have known (he died last night). John would have known. George Martin would have known. Linda would have known. Not just god.
YOUR PEOPLE CAN READ MINDS? DID YOU GET UP ON THE WRONG SIDE OF YER TORTURE RACK THIS A.M. OR IS THIS AN a a-i troll responding as YOU? FUNNY YOU DID NOT SAY ONLY YER HAIRDRESSER WOULD KNOW
Chief you may be an extremely talented humorist, but it's not coming through here in the comments, in all caps.
WELL IT JUST SO HAPPENS I LOST MY ARMS AND EYESIGHT AND IT IS HARD FOR ME TO DO MANY THINGS YA KNOW I BATTLE TROLLS DAILY WHOM ARE ON DRUGS AND ALCOHOL WHO SEEM TO THINK CAPITAL LETTERS ARE YELLING AT THEM SO I LET THEM KNOW I WILL PRAY FOR THEM WHETHER THEY LIKE IT OR NOT AND YES YOUNG MAN I AM A VETERAN. I HAD EXPLAINED ALL WHEN I FIRST SUBSCRIBED TO SUBSTACK
Lennon/McCartney = Gilbert & Sullivan...interesting notion!
HMS Pinafore = Yellow Submarine.
John and Paul have the same wry, anti-establishment wit as G&S.
Such a great album! Listening to it again reminds me of my father (now 92 years old), who at the time couldn't wait to hear what McCartney would do after the Beatles. He was so excited and played it over and over again. I was 12 and a big Beatles lover myself :-) This record grew on me as I moved into teenager-hood. Thanks!
I mean...talk about one of the great Side 2's ever...but then...this was the same year as Dark Side of the Moon.