This document is my proposed testing protocol for dioxin and dioxin-like compounds in East Palestine, Ohio and surrounding areas. Published by Chiron Return, Inc.
I was shocked to find that the NYC subway in the 1970s was "the most dangerous place in the world." I rode it all the time, at all hours of the day and night, and never even noticed. I was a white boy weighing about 120 pounds -- not exactly a menacing presence. I have much better NYC subway stories from that era...none of my friends ever had a problem. It was how we got around the city, got home from school, etc.
Cool! 15 yrs ago my foolish self stopped at Jane and Finch for food to wait out heavy evening northbound traffic after a conference. At the office Monday morning my secretary, in grandma fashion, said “ you did What, Where? When? Have you lost your wits??”
I was supposed to know how bad that area was, 15 yrs ago-its better now) “ Did you notice anything...Peculiar??” A dumb stare was all she got. Then: “Ya, shitty cars with locks on the steering wheels.. i mean, who would steal a shitty car?”And, ya, i was the only Caucasian around, so they were glad to give me teriyaki and a newspaper”
“Everybody in that neighbourhood, and I use the term loosely...”
Naive, yes, but its Canada, and what you don’t know maybe can’t hurt you.
I had lurid nightmares in the mid-late '60s (while living there) of gangs taking over trains and proceeding to attack, rob, rape passengers, fed by garbage fear peddling in the tabloids and by some total nuts. Nothing like that ever happened.
well the images were out there...and the fears...but to me it was an environment I navigated using common sense, stay in a center car, stay near the conductor (middle of the train), know what stations you want to avoid and so on. But I spent a heck of a lot of time at Brighton and Coney Island though that was mostly daytime. At night It was mostly W4th and W34th (the Village and Madison Square Garden). My own station (Kings Highway) was pretty mellow as well. I never recall feeling fear. I was not a stupid kid and I am risk averse.
I rode trains which run through Harlem and Bed-Stuy, even at night. My station (Inwood, upper tip of Manhattan) either Dyckman or 207th St) always mellow. At least back then.
Ok, got to jump in here. I grew up in NYC in the 60s. From the ages of 6 and 9 on, my sister and I walked all over the city exploring and took the subway by ourselves on excursions. Yes, there were weirdos out and about but it was a very different world.
Thanks for doing the recommendations. I have not heard anybody mention Seveso, one of the largest and most studied TCDD releases, useful to compare and inform testing strategies of environment and health. For example, Seveso ground zero benchmark of 15.5–5477 μg/m2 – called Zone A – from which many residents were permanently evacuated within a month and the homes demolished and buried. There was high animal and plant mortality after the exposure and within 2 years 80k animals had been slaughtered to prevent people from eating them. Seems testing animals, eggs, milk, and any uncovered feed should be high on the list; also, residues on any winter garden produce, fruit trees and popular forage spots, i.e. morels in the area – see map at https://www.thegreatmorel.com/morel-sightings/. People in the entire test area that radiated out from the Seveso hotspot, to where readings tapered off, were told not to eat any local produce or chickens at all. I understand it rained and snowed since the Ohio burn-off, so would rooftop residue now be accumulating on the ground around gutters? What about testing source point storm water runoff? Does dioxin remain in septic systems that are then pumped out and deposited in settling ponds somewhere? I imagine you will probably get to health test recommendations? Any funds donated for health testing should go first to pregnant and nursing women. There is reference to US breast milk background level study in the research papers.
Also this from STAT News: “Federal health officials are pressing Congress to fund a new office tasked with tackling the fallout from environmental exposures. But amid the first major environmental disaster of its existence, the East Palestine, Ohio train derailment, the tiny department seems unsure what to do — or if it can do anything at all.” Huh? Sounds like they need some tasks to justify their desired funding. Has anybody asked them to provide all existing baseline data on background dioxin levels for starters?
According to the studies, NIH and CDC contributed to the Seveso research and must be sitting on data. Are they stepping up to the plate in E. Palestine?
I cannot find an ESTAR in my email except substack related. please at elast put that word in your subject header. I have untold tens of thousands of emails in my inboxes! Also it helps if you write to efc@chironreturn.org -- that's pretty quiet.
Try searching your efc@chiron... inbox for Estar reply in the subject line. Also I exchanged several messages yesterday with "Eric F. Coppoline, Editor" at studio planet waves RE a secure connection fail notice I encountered on the site. That was sent from my same proton address.
Thank you so much for raising my awareness of these chemicals ... Now I know the entire Gulf Coast Region was exposed to Dioxins for 2 months when BP burned the Rig ...we had a local Dr Michael Robicheaux who set up a Clinic in a home on his property and detoxed ( Sauna , supplements following the Clear Body Clear Mind protocol )...saving over 100 poisoned victims ...Dr Mike helped all the locals for months ... Dr Mike was very perplexed in his research ... in his office were stacks and stacks of papers , articles, and journals he was searching for answers ... he kept saying " The more I research the closest thing I can come up with is AGENT ORANGE... but I'm not sure what the connection is" ...Eric you have given me this connection ... when they burned the Deep Water Horizon Situ Burn ... TCDD / AGENT ORANGE was released on the population of the Gulf Region ... and no body said one word ... what a cover up !! Thank you Eric !!
I would think the priority is to implement your suggested testing strategy quickly -- however it needs to happen -- before more precious time goes by. Texas A&M is doing independent air samples and now asking about dioxin, so that's good, but they need to refocus on soil and surfaces, according to my understanding of your work. They seem to be focused on checking EPAs figures. Either way I hope organizers are making a massive contact list of residents, farmers, allies, influencers, etc. They'll need it to push whatever strategy they decide on. Does anybody have a strategic plan? Who is taking the lead? E Palestine Justice? RVO? I have not seen a comprehensive grassroots website tracking all the balls in the air and taking names. I have a lot of questions and according to comments on various social media sites, so do a bunch of other people. People who are engaging and asking questions are a resource when it comes to grassroots organizing.
Gregory Lovett directed the movie relating to the military burn pit health issues and lack of VA assistance for those issues which occur years later. I wonder if he would be a good person to interview for your podcast and raise awareness of the seriousness. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_PyfiP3h2Qw
Eric - Since we know some of these toxins can accumulate in the fatty tissue of animals (and humans eating them), may I suggest that farmers test the fatty tissue of their livestock on an ongoing basis over the next year or longer (once a month)? Milk, cream, cheese and butter from both dairy cattle and dairy goats, pork fat and egg yolks. Due to the action of deuterium, both belly and back fat should be tested with pigs.
Cindy I just tried to download it it's all came up so do you want to download this and I said yes and then it downloaded it said download complete and I went to move it over to Bing according to what came up then and nothing showed up.
Eric I can't open the download. Is there some other way to get this? I watched a few videos yesterday of the poor people over there doing their own testing in some horrid gloppy water that had come back from that dam that came over the top and I just felt so so very sad for them.
Thank you for everything you're doing. There's quite a bit going on and hopefully this will stabilize and there will come out of it at least a safety plan in all regards.
ok let's see if there are any other complaints before I redo the mailing and the document. write to me at efc@chironreturn.org and I will send it to you directly. Your phone may not be able to read PDFs, which is the document format.
I confess I'm not a whiz on the phone that I am on the computer but I have read PDFs up there and I just can't get that thing to do anything. I will write to you and we'll see if you can send me something cuz I put all your stuff up on LinkedIn for my team 15K strong and I'm not saying everybody is seeing it but everybody that does really appreciates it.
On my phone, I had to scroll down and click to get onto the page (I forget if it was 'no thanks' or something else), and then it automatically downloaded the pdf onto my phone, so I had to open that up.
Strangely in this “safe-obsessed” world, I’m feeling a lot less safe than b4 the ridiculous obsession. It’s a considerably more deadly world.
I’ve gotten used to it.
I was shocked to find that the NYC subway in the 1970s was "the most dangerous place in the world." I rode it all the time, at all hours of the day and night, and never even noticed. I was a white boy weighing about 120 pounds -- not exactly a menacing presence. I have much better NYC subway stories from that era...none of my friends ever had a problem. It was how we got around the city, got home from school, etc.
Cool! 15 yrs ago my foolish self stopped at Jane and Finch for food to wait out heavy evening northbound traffic after a conference. At the office Monday morning my secretary, in grandma fashion, said “ you did What, Where? When? Have you lost your wits??”
I was supposed to know how bad that area was, 15 yrs ago-its better now) “ Did you notice anything...Peculiar??” A dumb stare was all she got. Then: “Ya, shitty cars with locks on the steering wheels.. i mean, who would steal a shitty car?”And, ya, i was the only Caucasian around, so they were glad to give me teriyaki and a newspaper”
“Everybody in that neighbourhood, and I use the term loosely...”
Naive, yes, but its Canada, and what you don’t know maybe can’t hurt you.
Toronto
I had lurid nightmares in the mid-late '60s (while living there) of gangs taking over trains and proceeding to attack, rob, rape passengers, fed by garbage fear peddling in the tabloids and by some total nuts. Nothing like that ever happened.
well the images were out there...and the fears...but to me it was an environment I navigated using common sense, stay in a center car, stay near the conductor (middle of the train), know what stations you want to avoid and so on. But I spent a heck of a lot of time at Brighton and Coney Island though that was mostly daytime. At night It was mostly W4th and W34th (the Village and Madison Square Garden). My own station (Kings Highway) was pretty mellow as well. I never recall feeling fear. I was not a stupid kid and I am risk averse.
I rode trains which run through Harlem and Bed-Stuy, even at night. My station (Inwood, upper tip of Manhattan) either Dyckman or 207th St) always mellow. At least back then.
Ok, got to jump in here. I grew up in NYC in the 60s. From the ages of 6 and 9 on, my sister and I walked all over the city exploring and took the subway by ourselves on excursions. Yes, there were weirdos out and about but it was a very different world.
Thanks for doing the recommendations. I have not heard anybody mention Seveso, one of the largest and most studied TCDD releases, useful to compare and inform testing strategies of environment and health. For example, Seveso ground zero benchmark of 15.5–5477 μg/m2 – called Zone A – from which many residents were permanently evacuated within a month and the homes demolished and buried. There was high animal and plant mortality after the exposure and within 2 years 80k animals had been slaughtered to prevent people from eating them. Seems testing animals, eggs, milk, and any uncovered feed should be high on the list; also, residues on any winter garden produce, fruit trees and popular forage spots, i.e. morels in the area – see map at https://www.thegreatmorel.com/morel-sightings/. People in the entire test area that radiated out from the Seveso hotspot, to where readings tapered off, were told not to eat any local produce or chickens at all. I understand it rained and snowed since the Ohio burn-off, so would rooftop residue now be accumulating on the ground around gutters? What about testing source point storm water runoff? Does dioxin remain in septic systems that are then pumped out and deposited in settling ponds somewhere? I imagine you will probably get to health test recommendations? Any funds donated for health testing should go first to pregnant and nursing women. There is reference to US breast milk background level study in the research papers.
Also this from STAT News: “Federal health officials are pressing Congress to fund a new office tasked with tackling the fallout from environmental exposures. But amid the first major environmental disaster of its existence, the East Palestine, Ohio train derailment, the tiny department seems unsure what to do — or if it can do anything at all.” Huh? Sounds like they need some tasks to justify their desired funding. Has anybody asked them to provide all existing baseline data on background dioxin levels for starters?
Short overview of Seveso: https://journals.lww.com/epidem/fulltext/2006/11001/the_seveso_accident__a_prototype_of_environmental.192.aspx
Some studies through the decades
https://cerch.berkeley.edu/research-programs/seveso-womens-health-study
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6221983/
https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2008/07/080728215326.htm
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0160412018313928?via%3Dihub#s0010
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0160412018330757
https://www.jstor.org/stable/4532521
According to the studies, NIH and CDC contributed to the Seveso research and must be sitting on data. Are they stepping up to the plate in E. Palestine?
Estar, can we talk some time soon? Thank you.
Yes. Sent you an email.
who is it from, some clue, so I can find it.
Did you find the email I sent you?
I cannot find an ESTAR in my email except substack related. please at elast put that word in your subject header. I have untold tens of thousands of emails in my inboxes! Also it helps if you write to efc@chironreturn.org -- that's pretty quiet.
Try searching your efc@chiron... inbox for Estar reply in the subject line. Also I exchanged several messages yesterday with "Eric F. Coppoline, Editor" at studio planet waves RE a secure connection fail notice I encountered on the site. That was sent from my same proton address.
On sorry. estarhasathought
Thank you so much for raising my awareness of these chemicals ... Now I know the entire Gulf Coast Region was exposed to Dioxins for 2 months when BP burned the Rig ...we had a local Dr Michael Robicheaux who set up a Clinic in a home on his property and detoxed ( Sauna , supplements following the Clear Body Clear Mind protocol )...saving over 100 poisoned victims ...Dr Mike helped all the locals for months ... Dr Mike was very perplexed in his research ... in his office were stacks and stacks of papers , articles, and journals he was searching for answers ... he kept saying " The more I research the closest thing I can come up with is AGENT ORANGE... but I'm not sure what the connection is" ...Eric you have given me this connection ... when they burned the Deep Water Horizon Situ Burn ... TCDD / AGENT ORANGE was released on the population of the Gulf Region ... and no body said one word ... what a cover up !! Thank you Eric !!
Short, concise, on target. Thank you!! Disturbing how some "freedom" people really don't get it.
I've got it. Thank you Cindy. It's really good. Concise, detailed and really on Target. I'm putting it up on LinkedIn now.
Thanks so much
I would think the priority is to implement your suggested testing strategy quickly -- however it needs to happen -- before more precious time goes by. Texas A&M is doing independent air samples and now asking about dioxin, so that's good, but they need to refocus on soil and surfaces, according to my understanding of your work. They seem to be focused on checking EPAs figures. Either way I hope organizers are making a massive contact list of residents, farmers, allies, influencers, etc. They'll need it to push whatever strategy they decide on. Does anybody have a strategic plan? Who is taking the lead? E Palestine Justice? RVO? I have not seen a comprehensive grassroots website tracking all the balls in the air and taking names. I have a lot of questions and according to comments on various social media sites, so do a bunch of other people. People who are engaging and asking questions are a resource when it comes to grassroots organizing.
The Handling of this Disaster is Crimes Against Humanity! Thank you Eric for all your expertise! God Bless You & Your Efforts!
Gregory Lovett directed the movie relating to the military burn pit health issues and lack of VA assistance for those issues which occur years later. I wonder if he would be a good person to interview for your podcast and raise awareness of the seriousness. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_PyfiP3h2Qw
Eric - Since we know some of these toxins can accumulate in the fatty tissue of animals (and humans eating them), may I suggest that farmers test the fatty tissue of their livestock on an ongoing basis over the next year or longer (once a month)? Milk, cream, cheese and butter from both dairy cattle and dairy goats, pork fat and egg yolks. Due to the action of deuterium, both belly and back fat should be tested with pigs.
Kyle
Ordinary people cannot do dioxin testing. This must be done by regulatory authorities.
I failed to make clear that I meant they could provide those samples to labs or the folks doing the testing.
there are strict rules for chain of custody of the samples. They can be easily invalidated.
In case you're wondering, I'm a farmer. What about farmers that want to do their own testing?
So people will have to take it into their own hands by raising money to fund experts certified to perform custom sampling according to best practices?
I am saying we need to take control of government because that's what it's for, and rely on the community chest known as the federal budget.
Let me try it because I am up on Google docs and that would be great. Thanks
Cindy I just tried to download it it's all came up so do you want to download this and I said yes and then it downloaded it said download complete and I went to move it over to Bing according to what came up then and nothing showed up.
On my phone, I have to go into 'downloads' or 'files' to find it and then open with google docs or whatever choices come up. Does that work for you?
Eric I can't open the download. Is there some other way to get this? I watched a few videos yesterday of the poor people over there doing their own testing in some horrid gloppy water that had come back from that dam that came over the top and I just felt so so very sad for them.
Thank you for everything you're doing. There's quite a bit going on and hopefully this will stabilize and there will come out of it at least a safety plan in all regards.
exactly what happens when you click the link?
I tried to download it on the phone and it just doesn't show up nothing shows up at all. It just comes up with a blank page.
I tried to open it and default browser which would be Bing and nothing happens.
ok let's see if there are any other complaints before I redo the mailing and the document. write to me at efc@chironreturn.org and I will send it to you directly. Your phone may not be able to read PDFs, which is the document format.
I confess I'm not a whiz on the phone that I am on the computer but I have read PDFs up there and I just can't get that thing to do anything. I will write to you and we'll see if you can send me something cuz I put all your stuff up on LinkedIn for my team 15K strong and I'm not saying everybody is seeing it but everybody that does really appreciates it.
On my phone, I had to scroll down and click to get onto the page (I forget if it was 'no thanks' or something else), and then it automatically downloaded the pdf onto my phone, so I had to open that up.
I can only do this as a PDF at this time. Please print and share. thank you.
Just giving some tips in case that works better. It's not obvious at first that you have to scroll down to get to the article...CTR