Hey, this is Eric's question, and I'm probably illegitimate to make ground rules for it, but were I to make a ground rule, I'd like the answers be one of the following:
1) hard physical evidence it happened (somewhere) or some military tech you can substantiate
2) a physical precedent in history (smallpox blankets don't count)
3) a movie, especially a James Bond movie.
Hey, this is Eric's question, and I'm probably illegitimate to make ground rules for it, but were I to make a ground rule, I'd like the answers be one of the following:
1) hard physical evidence it happened (somewhere) or some military tech you can substantiate
2) a physical precedent in history (smallpox blankets don't count)
Despite the stories about "smallpox blankets", we do not see proof or confirmation. To the contrary, in the 1950s, virologists [sic] mixed human scabs (from smallpox sores) with various liquids, then injected that "soup" into developing chick embryos. After the developing chicks suffered poisoning, Helbert (1957) writing in the Lancet claimed that such proved that there was a virus in the scabs (crust) and that such stayed ACTIVE up to 9 years!
Ironically, Downie and Dumbell (1947) using this same method found that one batch of egg cultures did not produce lesions. Hmm. No matter. I think that my chicken eggs will be fine so long as no one cracks the shell, and injects foreign material.
Then again, human scabs might possess virus ... even after nine years.
Slightly off topic, but will throw it into the mix. From a lady in Lombardy (the Italian epicenter where they initially had a lot of deaths).
She pointed out that the rest of the country shared airplane communication with China with similar numbers of Chinese immigrant laborers, but the rest of the country did not suffer the catastrophic deaths as Lombardy did.
The key difference was their previous year's flu vaccination. It rendered the old people fatally susceptible to sars cov-2 , while the elderly in southern Italy suffered no such loss. (search for Cathleen and Laura: https://arkmedic.substack.com/p/the-killing-fields-of-samoa/comments#comment-12501258 ) So this is not on Eric's topic, but it just shows the immune system is quite complex, and you can't exclude the certainty that it's possible to pre-dispose a segment of the population to die from the new virus. And that is also the theme of the arkmedic post - that many children in Samoa were literally killed by measles because they had been previously vaccinated for measles. So, weird attack mechanism #1, vaccinate for a variant that no longer is prevalent, then introduce a new one and see all the primed people pass away. (that did not happen in Wuhan, IMHO) )
Don't ignore the so-called vaping deaths across the country, the unexplained virus deaths across the street from a Bill Gates facility in Seattle, and the outbreak in Virginia in the spring of 2019. Surely those were all accidental and not practice runs for how to disperse virus, or to test how virulent it was.
Transmission: I've looked on & off for 3 years, I can't find a study that demonstrates the natural transfer of a malady via aerosol droplets. This would be a simple experiment...
Can you speak to US sanctions in Iran and how this has impacted the type of "homemade" fuel that has become widespread out of necessity due to those sanctions.
Can you speak to how that has impacted Tehran's air quality and the change in particulate matter?
Can you speak to how that has led to an increase in upper respiratory illnesses over the past decade in Iran?
Of course you can't- you haven't looked into it.
They just caught a "bug" in your historically, socially and ecologically illiterate world.
Yoichi Shimatsu is great on previous biowarfare attacks on Chinese agriculture with viruses, causing huge destruction of pigs. On Sars Cov-2 I'm not as much of a fan, but he says that a lake where Tilapia are raised was also used for military training (think seals) and played a role in the wuhan military games, and even played a role in Korea because the cult that started a super spreader event in Seoul also had a lot of people at this same lake, which supplied Tilapia to the Wuhan market. IMHO Mr Shimatsu is a way better author to read than Ian Fleming, even if he's writing non-fiction.
So how do I speculate it was spread in Wuhan? And you guys know it was discovered in Wuhan by the CIA way back in November, about two months before the Chinese managed to discover it. To me, that's starting to be great evidence of "who dunnit". Now, whether they did it with a candelabra in the drawing room or a rope in the conservatory ... my mind just doesn't go there. I'm more interested in pointing out bullshit and getting to truth, than engaging in speculation.
Oh, and this is from a teammate who is also involved in an internal lover's quarrel between Jay Couey and Kevin McCairn where Jay is saying essentially every outbreak worldwide is a separate intentional release due to the rapid attenuation of all corona viruses.
maziak тАФ Today at 9:16 PM
Hi @ToddRHarvey , I'm likely wrong, but here are my assumptions, in trying to resolve/progress the Kev-JC argument...
Kev:
[1]
A self-perpetuating respiratory illness occurred, having distinct pathologies (ground-glass lungs, other...)
This pathogen was bioengineered (coronavirus, spike, FCS...) & there is evidence for this (Defuse, moderna contracts, moderna patents, Baric's work...)
This respiratory illness propagated the pathogen, evidenced by the various cases of covid around the world, displaying the distinct pathologies.
This data together, gives enough explanation that there was a spreading respiratory illness propagating a dangerous lab-created bioagent
[2]
Adding the concept of infectious clones adds more layers of complexity:
- research around perpetuating a bioagent via an infectious clone
- labs working on the mechanisms to propagate infectious clones on a large scale
- mechanisms + logistics + people involved with propagating an infectious clone event open up more channels of discoverability / evidence
There is currently little evidence supporting those 3 points.
JC:
Coronavirus cannot sustain a pandemic, infectious clones could provide the means, etc...
The evidence & FOI you see is by design (to assist the Scooby Dooing)
(Hopefully this addresses your question: "we have proof of the viral infection logistics/players" )
From the Kev/Charles discussion, rather than an either-or, could not both be true: part-1 of Kev's argument + JC's argument.
Kev/Charles elaborated further, clarifying that the Kev-JC argument is more around part-2 of Kev's argument than part-1
@qwerty123 had a very good point re explicitly putting out evidence as a psyop, therefore how much of Kev's evidence can we trust (noting that some of that evidence is undisputed)
Personally find both argument avenues interesting & worth pursuing in their own right. Just wish JC didn't cause such a storm & be a bit more constructive on this mission. If you're interested in discussing more with the Coons, https://discord.gg/raccoonbunker . We've got virologists, MD's, MD/PhD's, aging hippies, ayahuascaman. In other words, all kinds.
At this point, there are few if any grounds for doubt that a Japanese-led biowar operation, so reminiscent of Unit 731, was involved in the infiltration of secret agents into the extensive Japanese and South Korea partnered fish farms in the Yangtze aquaculture sector, not only as buyers of fish but also suppliers of equipment and pharmaceuticals to prevent infection in the dense populations of farmed fish. This type of piscine delivery requires gene modification of the carrier species.
Hey, this is Eric's question, and I'm probably illegitimate to make ground rules for it, but were I to make a ground rule, I'd like the answers be one of the following:
1) hard physical evidence it happened (somewhere) or some military tech you can substantiate
2) a physical precedent in history (smallpox blankets don't count)
3) a movie, especially a James Bond movie.
Dear Todd Harvey,
Despite the stories about "smallpox blankets", we do not see proof or confirmation. To the contrary, in the 1950s, virologists [sic] mixed human scabs (from smallpox sores) with various liquids, then injected that "soup" into developing chick embryos. After the developing chicks suffered poisoning, Helbert (1957) writing in the Lancet claimed that such proved that there was a virus in the scabs (crust) and that such stayed ACTIVE up to 9 years!
Ironically, Downie and Dumbell (1947) using this same method found that one batch of egg cultures did not produce lesions. Hmm. No matter. I think that my chicken eggs will be fine so long as no one cracks the shell, and injects foreign material.
Then again, human scabs might possess virus ... even after nine years.
Best
Check Mongol on this , above.
Slightly off topic, but will throw it into the mix. From a lady in Lombardy (the Italian epicenter where they initially had a lot of deaths).
She pointed out that the rest of the country shared airplane communication with China with similar numbers of Chinese immigrant laborers, but the rest of the country did not suffer the catastrophic deaths as Lombardy did.
The key difference was their previous year's flu vaccination. It rendered the old people fatally susceptible to sars cov-2 , while the elderly in southern Italy suffered no such loss. (search for Cathleen and Laura: https://arkmedic.substack.com/p/the-killing-fields-of-samoa/comments#comment-12501258 ) So this is not on Eric's topic, but it just shows the immune system is quite complex, and you can't exclude the certainty that it's possible to pre-dispose a segment of the population to die from the new virus. And that is also the theme of the arkmedic post - that many children in Samoa were literally killed by measles because they had been previously vaccinated for measles. So, weird attack mechanism #1, vaccinate for a variant that no longer is prevalent, then introduce a new one and see all the primed people pass away. (that did not happen in Wuhan, IMHO) )
Your comment illustrates you know next-to-nothing about what happened in Lombardy.
Why don't you actually do some research on what happened before spouting such sophistry?
What you wrote here is beyond idiotic:
"From a lady in Lombardy (the Italian epicenter where they initially had a lot of deaths).
She pointed out that the rest of the country shared airplane communication..."
You heard some shit and then shoe-horned it into your presupposition.
I think you're lazy. You're just repeating esoteric nonsense and making conflations based on this.
Don't ignore the so-called vaping deaths across the country, the unexplained virus deaths across the street from a Bill Gates facility in Seattle, and the outbreak in Virginia in the spring of 2019. Surely those were all accidental and not practice runs for how to disperse virus, or to test how virulent it was.
Let's get some science/mechanics out of the way.
1) this thing does not spread by subway handholds. Or spitting. Or incidental contact.
2) it is aerosol spread
This discussion establishes that point: https://www.twitch.tv/videos/1728599665?t=4h9m21s
Transmission: I've looked on & off for 3 years, I can't find a study that demonstrates the natural transfer of a malady via aerosol droplets. This would be a simple experiment...
So, how was it spread in Teheran in March 2020 to infect 10% of the Iranian parliament and kill dozens? ( https://www.unz.com/page/covid-biowarfare-articles/ ) Beats the hell out of me. maybe something like this: https://www.cdc.gov/legionella/about/causes-transmission.html
Israel has thoroughly penetrated Iran. Maybe they have some capability beyond all our imaginations.
Maybe this, maybe that...
More speculative gibberish sans evidence.
Can you speak to US sanctions in Iran and how this has impacted the type of "homemade" fuel that has become widespread out of necessity due to those sanctions.
Can you speak to how that has impacted Tehran's air quality and the change in particulate matter?
Can you speak to how that has led to an increase in upper respiratory illnesses over the past decade in Iran?
Of course you can't- you haven't looked into it.
They just caught a "bug" in your historically, socially and ecologically illiterate world.
Just to be clear, I'm not saying "lab leak". I'm saying "intentional release". For your perusal: https://www.unz.com/runz/why-the-lab-leak-theory-is-almost-certainly-false/
Yoichi Shimatsu is great on previous biowarfare attacks on Chinese agriculture with viruses, causing huge destruction of pigs. On Sars Cov-2 I'm not as much of a fan, but he says that a lake where Tilapia are raised was also used for military training (think seals) and played a role in the wuhan military games, and even played a role in Korea because the cult that started a super spreader event in Seoul also had a lot of people at this same lake, which supplied Tilapia to the Wuhan market. IMHO Mr Shimatsu is a way better author to read than Ian Fleming, even if he's writing non-fiction.
So how do I speculate it was spread in Wuhan? And you guys know it was discovered in Wuhan by the CIA way back in November, about two months before the Chinese managed to discover it. To me, that's starting to be great evidence of "who dunnit". Now, whether they did it with a candelabra in the drawing room or a rope in the conservatory ... my mind just doesn't go there. I'm more interested in pointing out bullshit and getting to truth, than engaging in speculation.
Oh, and this is from a teammate who is also involved in an internal lover's quarrel between Jay Couey and Kevin McCairn where Jay is saying essentially every outbreak worldwide is a separate intentional release due to the rapid attenuation of all corona viruses.
maziak тАФ Today at 9:16 PM
Hi @ToddRHarvey , I'm likely wrong, but here are my assumptions, in trying to resolve/progress the Kev-JC argument...
Kev:
[1]
A self-perpetuating respiratory illness occurred, having distinct pathologies (ground-glass lungs, other...)
This pathogen was bioengineered (coronavirus, spike, FCS...) & there is evidence for this (Defuse, moderna contracts, moderna patents, Baric's work...)
This respiratory illness propagated the pathogen, evidenced by the various cases of covid around the world, displaying the distinct pathologies.
This data together, gives enough explanation that there was a spreading respiratory illness propagating a dangerous lab-created bioagent
[2]
Adding the concept of infectious clones adds more layers of complexity:
- research around perpetuating a bioagent via an infectious clone
- labs working on the mechanisms to propagate infectious clones on a large scale
- mechanisms + logistics + people involved with propagating an infectious clone event open up more channels of discoverability / evidence
There is currently little evidence supporting those 3 points.
JC:
Coronavirus cannot sustain a pandemic, infectious clones could provide the means, etc...
The evidence & FOI you see is by design (to assist the Scooby Dooing)
(Hopefully this addresses your question: "we have proof of the viral infection logistics/players" )
From the Kev/Charles discussion, rather than an either-or, could not both be true: part-1 of Kev's argument + JC's argument.
Kev/Charles elaborated further, clarifying that the Kev-JC argument is more around part-2 of Kev's argument than part-1
@qwerty123 had a very good point re explicitly putting out evidence as a psyop, therefore how much of Kev's evidence can we trust (noting that some of that evidence is undisputed)
Personally find both argument avenues interesting & worth pursuing in their own right. Just wish JC didn't cause such a storm & be a bit more constructive on this mission. If you're interested in discussing more with the Coons, https://discord.gg/raccoonbunker . We've got virologists, MD's, MD/PhD's, aging hippies, ayahuascaman. In other words, all kinds.
AHA - found the Yoichi Shimatsu post in my notes:
No bat or pangolins, maybe tilapia,. https://rense.com/general96/covert-19-bats-in-the-belfry.php.
https://rense.com/general96/how-cov-biowar-by-japan-uk-israel-hit-the-world-military-games-part-12.php
At this point, there are few if any grounds for doubt that a Japanese-led biowar operation, so reminiscent of Unit 731, was involved in the infiltration of secret agents into the extensive Japanese and South Korea partnered fish farms in the Yangtze aquaculture sector, not only as buyers of fish but also suppliers of equipment and pharmaceuticals to prevent infection in the dense populations of farmed fish. This type of piscine delivery requires gene modification of the carrier species.
Alabama resident almost died of Covid in Dec 2019. (prior to "discovery" in Wuhan). And he's from a rural area.
Alabama dec 2019 had the antibodies
https://www.uncoverdc.com/2020/06/25/an-alabama-man-nearly-died-from-covid-19-the-first-week-in-january/ IMHO this never was the Kung-Flu but the CIA Spook Flu.